08/04/2025 BOCC minutes
The Board of County Commissioners of Washington County, Idaho, does hereby meet this 4th day of August 2025.
IN THE MATTER OF ROLL CALL)
Donna White, Clerk, called roll call: Gordon Wilkerson, present; Jim Harberd, present; and Nate Marvin, present.
Jim Harberd opened the meeting and led the Pledge of Allegiance. Gordon Wilkerson gave the invocation.
IN THE MATTER OF CORRESPONDENCE/MEETINGS AND REPORTS)
Correspondence received by the Board was reviewed and disseminated as required.
Gordon Wilkerson stated he felt the fair was a huge success. There was discussion of raising funds for the construction/improvements to the facility. Wilkerson reported that he participated in a zoom meeting with IAC (Idaho Association of Counties) regarding infrastructure and Solid Waste. Wilkerson provided an overview of items of interest that were discussed in the IAC meeting.
Gordon Wilkerson moved, seconded by Nate Marvin, to approve an Alcohol Beverage Catering Permit to be used at Sunnyside Farms and Events, LLC, doing business as Sunnyside Sips on August 23, 2025. Motion carried.
Gordon Wilkerson moved, seconded by Nate Marvin, to approve an Alcohol Beverage Catering Permit to be used at Sunnyside Farms and Events, LLC, doing business as Sunnyside Sips to be used August 31, 2025.
Jim Harberd moved, seconded by Nate Marvin, to approve the Attorney Client Fee Agreement for Danny Roark with Logan and Copple PC, Attorney at Law at $300 per hour for Shawn Logan, $300.00 per hour for Malcolm Copple, $125.00 per hour for paralegals and $100.00 per hour for legal assistants. Motion carried.
Jim Harberd moved, seconded by Nate Marvin, to amend the motion to include a retainer fee of $5,000.00. Motion carried.
Nate Marvin read the Attorney/Client Retainer Agreement between Masingill Law as Attorney for Jim Harberd on the record in full.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to approve a Retainer Agreement between James Harberd and Masingill Law regarding a 1983 Civil Action Case, No. 1- 25-CV-00349 with an hourly fee $300.00 per hour, and a retainer fee of $5,000.00. Motion carried.
Jim Harberd read the Quit Claim Deed on the record regarding property sold at the Tax Deed Sale on July 28, 2025. The property is described as lots 7 and 8 of block 14, Fruitvale Addition, Weiser Idaho.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to allow the Chairman to sign the Quit Claim Deed regarding property sold at the Tax Deed Auction on July 28, 2025. Motion carried.
The Board discussed the Planning and Zoning Administrative Assistant job description. It was decided to add the review to the agenda for next week.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Jim Harberd, to do an Open Meeting Violation Cure as the Budget Workshop was not advertised as an open meeting on July 28, 2025. Motion carried.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Jim Harberd, to amend the original motion that what was discussed on July 28, 2025, at the budget workshop is null and void per an open meeting violation. All items will be addressed at the budget workshop this afternoon. Motion carried.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to cure an open meeting violation that happened in executive session with the Canyon County Prosecutor and Deputy Prosecutor in regard to retaining legal counsel to represent Washington County. They were asked to step out of the room while the Board discussed issues. No decisions were made in executive session during the July 24, 2025, Special Meeting. Motion carried.
The Board discussed the agenda for August 11, 2025. IN THE MATTER OF MINUTES)
The minutes of the Board not heretofore approved of July 28, 2025, were approved as written.
IN THE MATTER OF ROAD & BRIDGE/SOLID WASTE)
Jerod Odoms, Road and Bridge/Solid Waste Supervisor, met with the Board. Odoms stated he would meet with the Board during the Prosecutor’s scheduled time at 11:30 a.m.
Jim Harberd moved, seconded by Nate Marvin, to go into executive session at 11:20 a.m. in accordance with I.C. 74-206(1) (f) to communicate with legal counsel for the public agency to discuss the legal ramifications of and legal options for pending litigation, or controversies not yet being litigated but imminently likely to be litigated. The mere presence of legal counsel at an executive session does not satisfy this requirement. Motion carried unanimous. Gordon Wilkerson, Aye; Jim Harberd, Aye; Nate Marvin, Aye.
Jim Harberd stated they were out of executive session at 12:01 p.m. “No final actions or decisions were made in executive session. We will now return to the regular agenda.”
IN THE MATTER OF BUILDING INSPECTOR)
Danny Roark, Building Inspector, met with the Board. Roark stated that the Imagination Station had requested signature regarding State Licensing for the facility. Roark informed the Board that it was brought to his attention last Thursday. Roark stated he had signed the documentation so the facility could retain its State Licensing.
Roark discussed a non-conforming lot size in Cambridge. Roark informed the Board letters had been mailed to the applicant regarding the non-conforming lot size. Roark stated several complaints were submitted to Planning and Zoning. Roark reported that he had submitted the complaints to Sam Edwards, Chief Deputy Sheriff. Roark further stated that the complaints have been forwarded to the Prosecutor.
Roark discussed his personal application for a Temporary Housing Permit. Roark informed the Board that the plans were not approved last week. Roark stated that he hopes to have plans approved this week for the Board to sign. Roark provided a department update to the Board.
The Board discussed the Planning and Zoning Administrative Assistant job description. Marvin discussed the possible use of a temp agency.
IN THE MATTER OF ELECTED OFFICIALS AND DEPARTMENT HEADS)
Bonnie Davies, Weed Superintendent, stated spraying is continuing. Davis informed the Board that the County CWMA is part of the new Rangeland Resource Commission video. Davis stated it is an honor to be chosen and encouraged the Board to watch the video. Davis further stated that she had submitted paperwork for BLM (Bureau of Land Management) funding.
Dahlia Stender, Juvenile Probation Supervisor, presented the Juvenile Detention Housing Agreement with Canyon County to the Board for approval. Stender stated the daily rate has been increased from $235.00 to $240.00 per day. Stender informed that Board that she had submitted the Agreement to True Pearce for review but hadn’t heard back. Stender stated there were no significant changes in the Agreement other than the increased daily rate.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to have the Commissioners sign the Washington County/Canyon County Juvenile Detention Housing Agreement. Motion carried.
Stender discussed the Probation Standards Review Summary with the Board.
Stender informed the Board that some places are now charging an additional fee when using credit cards.
Johnny Biddinger, Emergency Manager, stated the State Area Field Officer was promoted to the Preparedness Branch Chief. Biddinger discussed State Homeland Security and the Emergency Management Program grant funding. Biddinger informed the Board he had not received notification of the amounts that will be received.
Robert Peterson, Information Technology Director, reported that Bonne Brent’s contact information has been removed from the County Website.
Tyler O’Donnell, Extension Educator, reported the proceeds from the fair livestock sale are currently $470,000.00. This is not a final amount. O’Donnell stated donations were collected for the extension of the livestock barn.
IN THE MATTER OF AMBULANCE)
Jim Harberd moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to recess as the Board of Washington County Commissioners and convene as the Board of the Weiser Ambulance District. Motion carried unanimous.
Donna White, Clerk, called roll call: Gordon Wilkerson, present; Jim Harberd, present; and Nate Marvin, present.
Alan Foster, Ambulance District Director, met with the Board. Order No. 25-42 for payroll expenses in the amount of $30,543.16 and Order No. 25-43 for general expenses in the amount of $10,427.15 was presented to the Board for review.
Foster discussed the possible hiring of a Tax Attorney for the purpose of an Override Levy for the District. Foster stated that he had talked with Valley County Administrative Assistant regarding the process. Foster further stated that Bill Gigray with White Peterson Attorney Firm could serve as the Tax Attorney. Foster discussed the cost and stated the estimated cost for Valley was between $15,000.00 to $20,000.00. Foster estimated the cost to the district between $10,000.00 to $15,000.00 in attorney fees. Foster discussed the promotional costs and process with the Board.
Marvin stated next spring might be the best option to put the proposed override levy on the ballot.
Foster informed the Board that Deputy Director, John Jess, will be resigning and taking a full-time position with Canyon County as large pay increases were approved in Canyon County.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to approve Order No. 25-42 for payroll expenses in the amount of $30,543.16. Motion carried.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to approve Order No. 25-43 for general expenses in the amount of $10,427.15. Motion carried.
Jim Harberd moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to recess as the Board of the Weiser Ambulance District and reconvene as Board of Washington County Commissioners. Motion carried unanimous.
Donna White, Clerk, roll call: Gordon Wilkerson, present; Jim Harberd, present; and Nate Marvin, present.
IN THE MATTER OF CITY OF CAMBRIDGE, AREA OF CITY IMPACT)
Mark Loveland, Mayor, Sandra McKee, City Clerk and Corey Morgan met with the Board.
Loveland stated they had revised the Area of Impact for the City of Cambridge.
McKee stated she had met with Prosecutor Pearce. McKee stated there are areas within the proposed Area of Impact that the city would not be able to provide infrastructure to such as Kincaid Heights. McKee stated that it would not be economically feasible in put infrastructure in Kincaid Heights. The revised map of the Area of City Impact was presented for review. McKee proposed the Impact Area would be part of City Ordinances. McKee reviewed the map indicating the proposed Area of Impact with the Board.
Pearce stated he was not giving specific legal advice on the decision. Pearce read Idaho Code 67-6526(b) on the record as follows: “An area of impact is where growth and development are expected to occur. Areas of impact should be planned for growth and development and should not be used to stop growth and development that conform to applicable plans and ordinances. Areas of impact should be established, modified, or confirmed based on the ability and likelihood of a city or cities to annex lands within that area of impact in the near future.” Pearce told the Board that that is basically what they were looking at. “Is this something that the city could or may likely do in the future?” Pearce continued reading the following form Idaho Code 67-6526(b), “A city may adopt a comprehensive plan and conduct infrastructure, capital improvement, and other planning activities that extend beyond its current area of impact. Counties and cities shall review their area of impact boundaries at least every five (5) years to determine if modifications are needed or to confirm existing boundaries and may pursue modification of an established area of impact more frequently than every five (5) years.”
Pearce told the Board that, “If you were to do something like what is being proposed today and decided next year that hey, a mine came into town and we need to relook at the whole thing, then you can do that as often as you need to in order to help the city with that Planning and Zoning issue.”
Marvin stated he liked the idea of not being stuck with it for five years.
Pearce told the Board that, “They only issue he would remind you of if you decide to use City Ordinances for the Planning and Zoning purposes, which I think makes sense, it’s going to be there, inside their City Limits eventually would be the idea that you guys still have the final decision on those issues. So, 67-6526(a) says ‘The legislature finds that areas of impact are properly under the jurisdiction of the county because the elected representatives of citizens in areas of impact are county officials, not city officials. While cities should receive notice of, and may provide input on, applications brought to the county in an area of impact, cities do not govern or control decisions on those applications. County commissioners make the final determination regarding area of impact boundaries within their county.’”
McKee stated the city would hold the first hearing and would be required to have a P & Z Commission with people in the impact area and in the city. McKee stated that the city would give a recommendation as they have been in the past but would be able to provide more input based on city ordinance.
Pearce asked,” What do you guys have that is not a subdivision for areas of impact right now as far as code? Are you prepared to take this over? Do you have code that would be applicable to this area that you have designated on the map?”
McKee stated that the city has “zoning, a Comprehensive Plan, a Future Land Use Map that says this is where we expect different things to go for residential, commercial, industrial type of things.”
Corey Morgan, Public Works Superintendent, stated they are currently working on code changes. Morgan stated there are already things in place to manage this. Codes are in place to manage the Impact Area. There was discussion regarding wastewater and storage capacity.
Pearce stated, “Even with the reduced size, we are still looking at possibly an impact area that is probably two or three times the size of the City of Cambridge right now even with all the reductions that were made. So obviously they are not going to annex all this in but this is still a pretty good-sized Impact Area based on a very small community. I think the other thing that needs to be addressed is, so you’ve got some fairly large parcels here. If you are going to do city code, do you have city code that is ready to address large parcels of A1 ag ground?” Pearce inquired if the City Code was ready to have the County apply it?
McKee stated that they have a subdivision ordinance so things that are brought in under that are going to be according to the subdivision ordinance just like the county subdivision ordinance.
Pearce stated that not everything will be a subdivision. “If somebody want to come in and just buy a few acres and live near town, is your code set up for that right now? Are you guys ready to deal with that?”
McKee stated the City Code already says what can be done in residential or commercial and what the requirements are.
Pearce asked the Board if they were familiar with the City of Cambridge Code. Marvin stated he had not read it.
Pearce told the Board that before they make a decision, they should be familiar with and okay with the City of Cambridge Code.
Morgan stated the current minimum lot size is 54×140 or 7,560 square feet, corner lots are 8,000 square feet minimum, setbacks are generally a 10-foot minimum on all sides, with an additional foot for eve height. Morgan stated there is one zoning requirement for residential, commercial is zoned C1 and C2. Morgan stated residential uses are allowed in the commercial zone.
McKee stated they do have an industrial zone, but nothing in the city limits now. McKee stated they are working on an overlay district that would only apply within the city limits.
Pearce asked if the minimum lot size would be big enough to allow city water and sewer hookups.
Morgan stated he believed the minimum lot size would meet the requirements of Southwest District Health.
Wilkerson question if a well and septic system would be allowed on a ¼ acre lot.
McKee stated that was the minimum lot size. A person will have to find/purchase a piece of land that will allow what they intend to do with it.
Pearce questioned how many lots were allowed without having a subdivision in City Code.
McKee stated the city code was the same as State Code.
Pearce stated you could do unlimited 5-acre splits under State Law on ag ground.
McKee stated there will not be any ag ground in the impact area. It will all be transitional.
Morgan stated the lot size is addressed in City Code under the residential zone. City of Cambridge Code 10-4-2(b) of city code read on the record. “ No Principal Dwelling Unit shall be erected or building altered to accommodate one family as a residence on a lot having less than forty thousand (40,000) square feet of lot area and width of at least one
hundred fifty feet (150′) per side, except where municipal water and/or public water and sewer systems are available, then the minimum lot size may be reduced.”
Wilkerson discussed the lot size, type of soil and Southwest District Health requirements.
Marvin asked if there had been a lot of 40,000 square foot lot approved by Southwest District Health.
Morgan stated that the last rezone that was completed in the impact area was the Holoboff rezone. Morgan stated they were able to get approval from Southwest District Health.
McKee stated that the City of Cambridge would hold the first hearing but the Commissioners would have final jurisdiction.
Marvin confirmed that a legal description was not needed.
Pearce referred to Idaho Code 67-6526 2(a) and read the following portion on the record: “ Following the notice and hearing procedures provided in section 67-6509, Idaho Code, and in accordance with the provisions of subsection (4) of this section, the board of county commissioners of each county shall adopt by ordinance a map identifying the area of impact within the unincorporated area of the county for each city.”
Pearce stated that there is nothing in the code that suggests it has to be surveyed or have legal descriptions. You are not allowed to split parcels. We already have description of these parcels in the county, so in theory, “we could just grab the boundaries all the way around of these parcels and we would have the outside description of them.” Pearce further stated that is not required. Pearce read Idaho Code 67-6526(c) as follows: “Prior to conducting the public hearings required under this chapter to establish, modify, or confirm an area of impact, cities and counties should work together to develop a proposed area of impact to be considered at the public hearing.” Pearce told the Board that is what you are doing today.
McKee clarified that the County would hold the Public Hearing and asked if the hearing could be held in Cambridge.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to approve the proposed Area of Impact for the City of Cambridge Impact Area as presented and to schedule a public hearing on the matter. Motion carried.
IN THE MATTER OF PROSECUTING ATTORNEY)
True Pearce, Prosecuting Attorney, met with the Board.
Nate Marvin moved, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson, to go into executive session at 12:01 p.m. in accordance with I.C. 74-206(1) (a & b) to consider hiring a public officer,
employee, staff member or individual agent. This paragraph does not apply to filling a vacancy in an elective office, (b) to consider the evaluation, dismissal or disciplining of, or to hear complaints or charges brought against, a public officer, employee, staff member or individual agent, or public school student; (c) to conduct deliberations concerning labor negotiations or to acquire an interest in real property which is not owned by a public agency; and (f) to communicate with legal counsel for the public agency to discuss the legal ramifications of and legal options for pending litigation, or controversies not yet being litigated but imminently likely to be litigated. The mere presence of legal counsel at an executive session does not satisfy this requirement. Motion carried unanimous. Gordon Wilkerson, Aye; Jim Harberd, Aye; Nate Marvin, Aye.
Jim Harberd stated they were out of executive session at 12:55 p.m. Harberd stated, “No final action or decision was made during executive session. We will now return to the regular agenda.”
IN THE MATTER OF BUDGET DISCUSSION/WORKSHOP/BUDGET PUBLICATION)
Jim Harberd asked for a roll call: Gordon Wilkerson, here; Jim Harberd, here; Gordon Wilkerson, here.
Nate Marvin stated he had made notes and talked to some people. Marvin said it had been said that the Commissioners had just got to see the budget last Monday. Marvin clarified that the Board had reviewed the proposed budget at a budget workshop the third week in June. Marvin stated that was the first time the Board had reviewed the budget. Marvin stated that he had talked with Prosecuting Attorney, True Pearce, County Clerk, Donna White and stated that part of the issue was, when Delton Walker was the County Prosecutor, he was charging the City of Weiser $5,000.00 per month per contract for attorney services.
White clarified that the County was in a contract with the City of Weiser for $5,150.00 per month for attorney services.
Marvin stated that revenue was lost which cut revenues short. Marvin further stated that there had been increased expenses. Marvin stated that the Annex Building went over budget and funds were used from the 2025 budget to make up for the “budget shortfall.” Marvin stated that the house for the prosecutor from the current budget. Marvin stated that improvements had to be made. It had an old furnace and air conditioning system; it didn’t have very good wiring for WiFi and the telephone. Marvin stated with Delton having Josh and Fred, their salary was $80,000.00 per year. Marvin stated that he thought Sean was bumped up to $100,000.00. Marvin continued and said that by looking at the Justice Fund and the Prosecuting Attorney’s budget, last year True didn’t get a raise. The budget that was put in there was $101,244.00. Marvin stated, “I don’t know how we are going to do it but I would like to see us all put our heads together and see if we can’t get True bumped up to a 3% cost of living. I know Donna has worked her butt off, Brenda,
everybody in the Courthouse has worked hard on this budget, trying to make it work and it’s a difficult task because we have to stay in compliance with the levy rate. We are governed by legislature. Three percent is all we can raise the budgets. Last year I think it was the legislature came back with another eight percent cap that applies to some of the budgets that we are dealing with. I know Donna has the budget balanced now so we can move stuff around, but I would prefer not to raise the budget because I don’t know where we are going to get the money quite frankly. Looking through, and I don’t know where Matt is, but he’s got some money in here for.”
Matt Thomas, Sheriff, stated, “I’m not cutting my budget, I cut mine last year.” Marvin stated, “You have money in investigation here that didn’t even get used.”
Thomas stated, “So does True. He has 15 grand. If you want to give True a raise, take it out of his budget.”
Marvin said, “He doesn’t have it to take out of his budget.” Thomas stated, “Neither do I.”
Marvin told Thomas, “You got money in investigations that you have only used
$4,500.00 this year.”
Thomas said, “I could have something happen and it gets pulled.”
Marvin said, “Well, True’s got the same situation if he has to hire for an outside case. We got, like I say, we’ve got to put our heads together and make this work guys.”
Thomas, “You know what I think should happen? You guys are hemorrhaging money left and right.”
Marvin, “We’re doing what?”
Thomas, “Hemorrhaging money. All these lawsuits you have to pay for. Why are you giving raises, period?”
Marvin, “You think we should just pull all the raises out?” Thomas, “Don’t take crap out of my budget.”
White addressed the Commissioners, “Each fund in the County budget is a stand-alone levy. You have a levy for Current Expense, Road and Bridge, District Court, the Justice Fund, the only fund, the list goes on of all the County funds that we have. The only fund that is up against its levy rate is the Justice Fund. This happens year after year as former Commissioner Chandler and Commissioner Collini can testify to that. They have sat here
through these budget hearing and workshops before. The Justice fund has always been an issue. Am I correct?”
Chandler and Collini replied, “Yes.”
Chandler stated, “We used the PILT fund to balance it.”
White stated, “We did. My projection for the PILT money to, for into the Justice Fund for and the money that we receive today and in this fiscal year is used to fund our next budget. So, the revenue that we have received since October 1 through September 30 of 2025 is used to help fund the budget that we have going forward. So that being said, when we received our PILT distribution for this year, I put, my projection for the 2025 budget year to fund the 2026 budget was $450,000.00. We received and deposited into the Justice Fund on the revenue side $525,000.00. I started putting that money into the revenue side of the budget when I came to work here because they were up against their levies, they couldn’t increase. A portion went to Current Expense, and a portion went to the Court Fund. Then, this year was the Idaho Power Judgment and the County paid that for all the taxing districts. The County’s portion was $898,000.00. We paid that from our rainy-day funds, from the PILT money. So, we depleted, we had $1.5 and we depleted that down to make that payment so that nobody had to pay interest or got fined, countywide. I’m talking all taxing districts, the cities, the schools, all sixteen or eighteen taxing districts that we have within the county. Then we asked those taxing districts to pay us back. They have the option to go for a judgement levy. The Commissioners made a motion and decided that the County would not go for a judgment levy thus putting that bill of $800,000.00 for the County’s proportionate share back onto the taxpayer. That’s what we did with our rainy-day funds. It was an effort to not bill or do a double dip to our taxpayers to pay that bill.’
White continued, “So, in the Justice Fund you do have Emergency Reserves. It is in 8-4. That being said, with the retainer fees that are due, that’s $13,400.00, retaining the Canyon County Prosecutors Office to defend the County, that’s another $20,000.00 out of Emergency Reserves. Then there is discussion of, and I don’t know if I can say this in open record but buying land to build a road. We don’t know what that dollar amount is. We don’t know, the City of Weiser, that’s been in the paper, is suing the County over the prosecutor’s house over here on 343 Main. That lawsuit asks that the County pay the attorney fees. We don’t know what that is. So, you’ve got $200,000.00 projected in Emergency Reserves to pay for these pending lawsuits and we don’t have a dollar amount. We don’t know what that is going to end up costing the County.”
Thomas stated, “I have an open patrol position that I am not filling because I don’t know where this county is going to be next year and you’re wanting to take money out of my budget.”
Marvin requested Thomas come up to the mic.
Thomas restated, “I have an open patrol position right now that I am not going to fill because I don’t know where this County is going to be next year and you guys want to take more money out of my budget.”
Marvin stated, “I’m just looking for suggestions, Matt.” Thomas asked, “Why are we even looking for suggestions?”
Marvin stated, “Because if you had some money in your budget that’s not being utilized, if you don’t, that’s what I need to know.”
Thomas stated, “I don’t have any money.” Marvin, “Okay.”
Thomas, “So, I just, don’t touch my damn budget. You guys are going to piss me off.” Marvin, “It’s not your budget, Matt. It’s everybody in this room’s budget.”
Thomas, “It is, but it’s budget that I have to work with.” Marvin, “Yeah, it’s the county taxpayers’ budget.” Thomas, “Yeah.”
Marvin, “Yeah. So don’t say it’s your budget.” Thomas, “It’s the budget I have to work with.” Marvin, “Yeah. I would agree to that.” Wilkerson, “So, True doesn’t have a budget?”
Thomas, “Yeah. You can cut his budget if he wants a raise.”
Marvin, “He doesn’t have any money to cut. We need to find…The problem is we can’t transfer money out of Road and Bridge; we can’t take money..
Thomas, “Yeah, I know. I haven’t taken a raise in two or three years and I’m not complaining about it.”
Marvin, “I know you haven’t.”
Thomas, “Do what you guys want to do but.”
Marvin, “I’m looking for positive suggestions here, how to resolve this.”
Thomas, “What is there to resolve? There’s a budget right now, there’s a proposed budget.”
Marvin, “There’s a shortfall in the Justice Fund and we’ve known that. It happens every year.”
Thomas, “So why keep trying to add money to it?”
Marvin, “We’re not adding money, we’re just trying to move some money around.” Thomas, “Yeah. Why? What reason?”
Marvin, “Well, because, well we haven’t decided yet, but in the works is a 3% cost of living raise for all the employees. Last year True didn’t get a cost of living.”
Thomas, “Neither did I.”
True Pearce, Prosecuting Attorney, addressed the Board. “Mr. Chair, may I?” Harberd, ‘Go ahead.”
Pearce, “So, let’s correct things here a little bit just to be clear. Um… Last year, a cost- of-living increase, a COLA, was given to the entire county of 4%, I believe. Is that accurate?
Marvin, “That was my understanding.”
Pearce, “And, um, in doing research legally, when you give a cost-of-living increase, uh, you cannot pick and choose who you give it to. It’s not legal. You can’t discriminate against people. In fact, it’s even been suggested that you cannot not accept it if you’re an elected official, because eventually those add up, and it means that if you have to be replaced that nobody wants the job. So, I understand that there’s people in the county that have not accepted cost of living increases in the past, like the sheriff just mentioned. He didn’t accept his last year. Um, it’s my understanding, though, that that’s not… that shouldn’t be an option. If you’re giving a cost-of-living increase to the entire county, you have to give it to everyone. They can donate it back if they don’t want the money. Uh, the issues that I have had with this budget is that if you go to page 44, where this budget is at, we requested an increase, and the only reason I care about an increase, and so let me be very clear about this. Uh, I don’t care about the money. I didn’t come here to take this job for the money. I can make a lot more money somewhere else. It is not about the money, and it never has been. The issue that I have that I am unhappy about is the fact that a cost- of-living increase, a COLA was given to the entire county, or at least offered to them, whether they accept it or not, is on them at this point. It was not given to the prosecuting attorney, though. So, Mr. Harberd was in the same position I’m in, whereas when he was newly elected. He hadn’t done this job before. He got the 4% cost of living increase. The
prosecutor was not given it. He’s the only elected office that was not offered to. So, that’s the only issue there. So, I don’t need a cost-of-living increase this year. I don’t need to take money out of the sheriff’s budget, I’m not asking for that. I want the cost-of-living increase that should have been given last year, and I think it should be reimbursed from January going forward. The other alternative to that would be that every other elected official give up that 4% cost of living increase so that it’s equal and fair across the county. We’ve heard that there are… that we’re facing many challenges, many of them which are out of our control at this point, and, and truly, there are more than what even we can discuss at this point. You guys know what I’m talking about. And so, if we’re in that big of a crunch, then what are we doing giving anybody 3% increases on this budget? If you go to the very first page under the clerk, we are seeing a 3% wage increase. 3% wage increase. If you go through this budget, there are 3% wage increases throughout this entire thing. And so, um… I don’t need a 3% increase this year. I think that I’m owed the 4% that was never paid to me as the elected prosecutor, but if we’re not giving them to everybody, I don’t understand why we’re doing it at all. I also have questions, and maybe they’re easily answered. I don’t understand them. So, for example, under my budget, under line 042… We have $160,000 in there last year. We’ve only used 42% of it this year. Where is the rest of that money at? Down here further, under my contingency account has just been completely removed, no one has spoken to me about that. Uh, on further down under uh, contracts, it’s 0689. We used that budget this last year. In fact, we used more than was in there, and it’s just been completely removed from my budget altogether this year. It’s gone. If you go through and add up everything that has been taken out of my budget this year versus last year, it is $100,330.00 negative. I… as far as I can tell by going through and adding up all the other numbers, that is the only budget to have been cut that amount of money. Now, I understand we don’t have the city contract. Uh, and that that has made a difference, but that was $60,000.00. And the fact that you guys had to buy a building, that is a statutory requirement under code that you provide a billing to the prosecutor. What has been happening in this county in the past with how it’s been done, is not… was likely not legal, and so you don’t get to blame how that was done on me, or act as though somehow my budget should reflect the fact you guys have never provided an office like you should have. Um, so I… I… maybe it’s easily explained, um, why there is no money, especially since we haven’t used most of it in our budget thus far this year. Um, but I believe that we’re at only… Um, actual usage is 61%, and we only have 2 months left. So why is there no money left in my budget? Where is this $100,000 going to go? What budget did it make it into? Those were the questions that I have. I am fine sacrificing for the county if that is what is necessary. I understand that we’re in this together. I don’t wish to see the sheriff’s budget get cut. That is not what I’m asking for, but I have some questions that I would like answers to, so do maybe one of you commissioners can tell me where did all this money in my budget this year go?
Marvin, “It looks to me,True that it’s been put into the Justice Fund in other places.” Pearce, “Can you show me? I actually would love to be shown.”
White, “Commissioners, may I? Just one moment please. True, when you turned in your paperwork to me and this is what I got. With very few line items that you marked with
what you want. The ones that I took that you wanted to keep are the ones that you put the blue line by. Then we sent this out. I put this in your basket up in the Clerk’s Office, said please review same as I do with everybody, every department head. They all get a copy after I enter the numbers into the computer program and then I give everybody their paperwork and say please review for accuracy to make everything… and you never came back to me. You never said anything was right, wrong or indifferent. And then as far as the prosecutors’ $160,000.00 wage line, when that contract with the City was put into place and the City agreed that Josh Dalton would be their attorney, that’s what that contract money was for. We had two prosecutors, deputy prosecutors at that time. That contract was to help foot the bill for those two prosecutors, deputy prosecutors. So then when the contract went away, and Josh and Fred Wheeler were both making $80,000.00 a year. Sean came in, I don’t care what you pay your people, I don’t, but Sean came in and you put his wage at $100,000.00. So that, and then the contract went away so that’s where revenue to fund that position went. Do you understand that?”
Pearce, “I do.”
White, “Okay. Then you didn’t mark on here but you did ask for $82,000.00 for your secretaries. You can take a portion of that because that is over what they currently make or will be making even at 3%. As far as the other lines in your budget that were removed or taken out, that is because you did not put anything in there.”
Pearce,” So, let’s just clear up a couple things. I… this is the first time I’ve ever heard of having a basket in the clerk’s office. I assume”
White, “We had that conversation before and you asked me if your secretary know about that and I told you ‘yes she did’.”
Pearce, ‘Okay, well, I have an email, and I also have a mailing address. I am not in that building.
White, “I emailed the department heads and told that that their paperwork was there.” Pearce, “I will go back and look for that. I’m not aware of having seen that.
White, “I have not changed the policy of doing budgets since the day I got here.”
Pearce, “So, it still does not explain, though, why it’s 100,000 short versus even… we… there should have even been less than the 60 that was in there from the city that was revenue that had not come in. And I certainly did not ask that the contract line be removed. And when I came and gave my budget, I spoke to the commissioners. I was very specific about what we did and did not want, and what could and could not be cut.”
Marvin, “True, in the contracts was the $10,000.00 on line 689?” Pearce, “Correct.”
Debbie Moxley Potter, Assessor, discussed the budget request paperwork with Pearce. Moxley-Potter showed her budget request paperwork to Pearce.
Pearce, “ So… So, okay, well, in the open meeting with the commissioners, that is not what the record would reflect. So, I apologize, this is the first year I’ve done the budget in this county, and if that is not how it should have been, a phone call or an email, or anything along those lines would have been helpful in that situation. It still does not answer the question, though, of where the rest of that money has gone to from my budget this year, because it existed in there regardless. We knew that the city contract was ending last year. It was budgeted to be in there this year, so the question is, is still, where is it? We only used a certain amount of it. So, regardless of whether the city paid it in or not, it was still budgeted. And it would have at most been $60,000, and some of it would have been used in the 3 months in the year prior.
Thomas, “It would have come from revenue from past contracts.”
Pearce, “But it would have only been $60,000, and some of it would have been used. There should have been money from when Fred Wheeler and Josh Dalton left early that was in that budget from October onward.”
Marvin, “But you didn’t have the revenue coming in to cover that expense.”
Pearce, “It was only $60,000.00. We’re down 100,330 in this budget. And as for my secretary, that was not an increase. That was so the county did not get a wage hour violation, based on what had been happening in the county prior to me being here. We’re required by law to pay the hours that are worked.
White, “And her hours at the County were set at 37 and a half. There was a time in the County when they did…”
Pearce interrupted and stated, “So, it would not be good for the liability of the county for me to discuss this with you in open meeting.”
White addressed the Board and stated,” So, Commissioners, from, with the remodel of the annex building and the work on the prosecutor’s house, these things came out of the Justice Fund, and we have tracked it in my office, and the total expenditures out of the Justice Fund for unexpected expense for those two buildings was $100,764.60 excuse me
$100,000.00 and then another $12,215.39 so $112,000.00 of unanticipated expenses were paid from Justice Fund Building and Ground for expenses on those two buildings.
Pearce, “So, Commissioners, you’re not allowed under law to spend money that you have not budgeted.”
White, “I didn’t say it wasn’t budgeted. I said it came out of the Building and Grounds budget within the Justice Fund.”
Pearce, “I didn’t… wasn’t talking about that. You’re not allowed to spend money that you haven’t budgeted. If I had spent all the money in my budget for this year. Then the question is, if it wasn’t there, where did it go? Because you budgeted it. We have not used the money that is in my account this year. Where is it?”
Marvin, “So you are referring to the salaries for the deputies?”
Pearce, “I’m referring to the whole budget. If you look at the total budget amount for the prosecutor’s office, we are budgeted for $433,650 for this year. You are required to have that money if you’re going to budget it. I could have spent that much. Obviously, we didn’t need to. We’ve only used 264,699 as of now, and there’s only 2 months left of this year. Where is the difference?”
Wilkerson, “I’ve looked the budget over, and I can’t find where the money’s gone. I can’t find the increases to anything else. Is that what you’re saying?”
Pearce,”Yeah. We haven’t used it, and yet we were budgeted for it.” Thomas and Davis stated, “It’s carryover.”
Davis, “our expenditure activity sheets that we get once a month, and I’m just speaking as a department head, not as an elected official. When I get mine, it’ll tell me what my remaining cash balance is. Does that make sense? Because that’s got to keep funding that budget. Because, you know, we don’t like when my new budget starts October 1 for the weed department and Gopher. We’re not going to get any more revenue in until the January taxes are turned over. So, unless people, you know, come in pay their taxes late and those things. Um, so those monies have to carry me forward to January. Does that make sense? So, I always watch that cash balance because I can’t have more budgeted money left than I do cash balance. It’s gotta support it. And, like, my budget, for instance, it has a line item in it. That’s not funded. It’s a grant line item, in case the grant falls from the sky and we’re able to take it so we can roll it into our budget and expend those funds. Our fund is kind of unique, but yeah, the cash balance is just as important to me as a department head. As it… as, you know, whatever your budget balance remaining is, or your starting budget, or… Or whatever that may be. That makes sense at all?
Pearce, “No, so your budget does not start over again in October?”
Thomas, “It does, but next… So we’re working off this budget, but part of the money that is leftover builds next year’s budget. So that’s what Donna figures out. This is what she projects as what’s going to be left over out of this year’s budget. She put that into the revenue side for next year along with the tax, property taxes, and all the other revenue that the county gets, and then she builds that budget with whatever money the county has. There’s only so much in the Justice Fund that you run out of money after a while. It’s just not there.
Pearce, “I understand, but it was unknown at the time when we first started whether we would need to hire a second deputy. And I was, I mean, told very clearly from the commissioners, um, and one of the commissioners that is no longer in office. That, um, that money was there in case I needed to hire another deputy. So we’ve only used 42% of that deputy’s salary. We’ve not hired another deputy. So, that money, that 42% of a
$160,000 budget, was budgeted for. So where is it? Why is it that that cannot be used? So why can we not use that rollover money to replace my $10,000.00 contract budget that just completely got removed. I should have plenty of money in my rollover budget.”
Thomas, “It’s not just rollover money, it’s property tax that feeds this budget. It’s revenue that the jail makes, the sheriff’s office makes, you make, that feeds this budget. If there’s not as much revenue and not as much carryover, then… we got to work within what you have and stay within the levy limit.”
Pearce, “So, we didn’t have the money that was in this budget last year? It was not… we were… we did not have the money to fund this budget as it was budgeted?”
Thomas, “If it was budgeted, you had the money to fund it but next year, starting October 1, you don’t have the money.”
White, It doesn’t… what Matt’s trying to tell you, I guess maybe in… is that when we did the budget for 2024, then you came into office in January. At that time, that contract with the City of Weiser went away.
Pearce, “correct.”
White, “We no longer receive that revenue. Then at the end of the day, I have to take the remaining cash, which Bonnie referred to, I have to do a projection of expenditures based on history, for the last 4 months of this year, the first 4 months of next year, and then I have to do the same thing with revenue, anticipated to come in. And I do it all based on history and the reports that I have. So it’s add and subtract based on the cash balance, and the Justice Fund as a whole, When… when you look at the monies, it’s as a whole. It’s not just your department, it’s you, the Sheriff, the Jail, Search and Rescue, Building and Grounds, it’s all one. And it doesn’t mean that we took more from you or more from Matt, or more from Search and Rescue. That doesn’t… that’s not what it means. It means we took the total sum of the remaining cash, and then we took the total sum of the cash carryover, and then we took the total sum of the anticipated revenue, and we came up with the balance to levy for. So, for the Justice Fund, the total anticipated budget for the coming year is $5,741,600. Of that. We are going to levy for $2,900 and… 900… oh, 2,900,100.00 and that is to fund the entire Justice Fund as a whole. Our remaining cash, the last one that the commissioners received, or our statement of cash was $15 million.
This proposed budget is 20 million. And we are levying for $6,866. So basically, we are levying for the entire Justice Fund, except for $1,100,000. That’s what we are levying for from the taxpayer. Basically, to fund our justice fund. Even though it’s broke out through all the departments, current expense, road and bridge, all of the departments, except the
ones that do not levy taxpayers’ dollars for. That’s what we’re doing here. That’s how we fund the county as a whole.”
Marvin, “So on that line item 402 on prosecuting the attorney’s budget. The 160 was the budgeted amount.
White, “That was the budget that was created by our former prosecutor when he had two prosecutors and one of them was primarily funded through that city contract. Each one of those was paid $80,000 a year.”
Marvin, “But it was based also on monthly income and the revenue coming in?” White, “Yes.”
Pearce stated he understood that, “but one-third of that would have still came in right? One-fourth of it? Three months? October, November, December would have still come in.
Marvin. “3-4 months, yes”
Pearce, “So, that amount should have still been in there, and we weren’t paying two deputies at that time.
Marvin, “Right.”
Pearce, “So, all of that money that should have been in that budget from the city would not have even been paid out to those deputies.” So I understand that we would be down that amount, but it should have only been two-thirds.
White, “That amount, but you’re also down all of the extra expenses that went into the annex building for the remodel and for the upkeep and the repairs and the maintenance that went into the office that you now occupy that were unplanned for, but the county had to pay those bills. Yes, it was in the Justice Fund, but it pulls as a whole. It doesn’t pull… When you have current expense, that’s a whole. That’s the Clerk’s office, the Assessor, the Treasurer, IT, the Commissioners, the list is long, Planning and Zoning, Building and Grounds, all of those departments are combined in one whole lump sum of Current Expense. Justice Fund is no different. It’s one whole fund that has to supply everybody that has paid for, paid to, expenses incurred, it all comes out of one pot of money. You don’t get to say, this is my dollar, and this is Matt’s dollar. You don’t get to say that. It’s
all combined.
Thomas, “The Justice Fund spent more money this year than normal, plain and simple. There was more money out of the justice fund than there usually is. There is not as much carryover. Emergency funds are gone, the rainy-day funds are gone. The cash that we had when we wrote the budget we are working on now, we don’t have. So, we don’t have the carryover, we don’t have the extra money to build this budget.”
Marvin, “That makes sense.”
White, “And don’t take that wrong. I know it is out there on the street that the County is broke. We are not broke, people. I don’t know who started that, but that is NOT true.
Things may be a little tighter, we have used our rain-day funds. We used ARPA money to put the secure entry on this building two years ago. So that was federal money that the county received, and it was not taxpayer dollars that were pulled from the budget. We did the remodel, that was over $2 million on that annex building. That was additional one- time PILT money that we received. There were added expenses that weren’t planned on that we had to pay for out of the county budget, yes. But the bulk of that remodel came from PILT funds. We put over 500… no, over a million dollars in PILT money into the current budget that we are trying to build to fund the county’s budget for 2026. And
$525,000 went into the Justice Fund alone. My projection was $450,000. That’s what I projected when I was projecting what revenue to go into this budget for the Justice Fund in 2024 to build the 2025 budget. So, I exceeded the amount of revenue anticipated to go into that, but we also had unanticipated expenses that had to be paid.”
Robert Bennatts, “I have a question. I’m just kind of from the prosecuting attorney point of view, what this is going to do to his, uh, his agency. How is losing his budget for the current time, and then projecting, uh a weaker budget next year? Is that what’s going on? How is that going to affect your ability to do your job?”
Pearce, “Am I okay to answer that, Mr. Chair?” Harberd, “Sure.”
Pearce, “Okay, so… this line that we’ve been discussing, this contracts other that got removed, we were budgeted for $10,000 this year. We actually have already used
$10,352.50 of that line. So, that was something that we, uh, when we went to Holland and Hart for an opinion on the county code to make sure that the advice that we were giving the county was correct. That is what they charged us in that line. In years past, that amount has been something like $60,000 or $70,000 that has been used to pay, uh, other law firms for opinions and advice. So the fact that it’s completely removed. Uh, it very likely could cause us problems in the next year, should we need to Uh, use that.
If we end up with a murder, if we end up with unforeseen circumstances um, we just won’t have any extra money to be able to handle those situations.”
White, “So, the contract line for 2025 was $10,000 and we’ve spent $10,352. It was not indicated on the paperwork that I received that he anticipated having money in that line. You also…Back in the day, when I talked to the Board of Commissioners that were the sitting board at the time when I came to work here, I told them that they did not have any monies should something happen. So we put emergency reserve money in the Justice Fund. I said, in the event that you get a lawsuit, which is where we are today, you have that money to cover that. Correct?”
Chandler and Collini responded in agreement.
White, “Did the same thing in Current Expense. Last year, to balance the budget, we withdrew, Matt and I talked, we took money out of that. We bumped it down to $137,000 from $200,000 to balance the Justice Fund. So that we could do what, what was requested after Matt and I did cuts to his budget. This is not a new thing.”
Thomas, “It’s every year with the Justice Fund, I’ve been doing this since 2011. Every year, with my mom (inaudible) Every year, I have to go in there and… start chopping away at what I put in. It’s just… that’s how the justice fund budget works.”
White, “And it’s not… It’s not specific to Washington County people, it’s across the board. For Emergency services, the Justice Fund, the Sheriff’s Department, this is across the board, not just here. With that being said, in Emergency Reserve, in the Justice Fund, going forward through, for the 2026 year, I put in, I increased it back from the $137 up to
$200,000. And like I said, you’re already, with no bills being paid, we’re over $40,000 to
$50,000 expected to be paid from that.” Pearce, “This is the Emergency Fund.”
White, “It’s an Emergency Reserve, yes, within the Justice Fund.” Wilkerson, “What line is that?”
White, “It’s on page 46 and that has been in existence since 2014. That’s how, when we have the snow event, Snowmagiddon, whatever you want to call it, and we had to have all of these outside entities come in and help remove the snow and shovel roofs and all of those things. That’s how we paid for it. Was out of the Emergency Reserve funds. And that cost at that time was $180, $190,000.”
Harberd acknowledged Chandler.
Chandler, “So, Donna is right in the fact, and I appreciate that, when she started being the clerk, she made a Justice Fund I mean, an emergency fund in the General Fund and the Justice Fund, and that is what we were able to take care of the snow event with. If we wouldn’t have had that, we wouldn’t have been able to do anything. But, uh, while I was in there, I voted for pay increases and increases in the budget because we had the money and we could justify it. But I think under the circumstances right now, if the lawsuit’s pending, and the amount of money that we know is coming after our county funds, and will eventually get… get… dumped over onto the citizens of the county. I always said I was okay with raises when we had it. But there would come a day where the… the employees of the county would have to give some of that back. And I think this is a year where, at least there shouldn’t be raises anywhere in the county, if not cuts in some places. Now Matt, he took a $4,000 a year cut last year and didn’t take a raise. So I think there comes of time when the county officials are going to have to say ‘We can’t afford raises, we can’t maybe even afford what we’re paying.’ And the wages in the county are the major expense in the county, and when we have to cut back on services and… cuts
back on stuff, like. Matt says he isn’t even going to be able to hire deputies. You know, when we have to get to that point, the first place that should be looked at is the wages. And because the Commissioners, some of the decisions that have been made have put us in the position, and they should act in a way that would help get out of it, and that’s gonna be the first way to do it.”
Pearce, “Commissioners, I guess, if it’s necessary that my office take a $100,000 cut over last year, then I guess I would agree with what’s been said, is that there shouldn’t be any increases anywhere else in the budget. So, I guess that’s all that I would have to say about that, and I’ll stand on that.”
Harberd acknowledged Lisa Collini.
Collini, “Um, as a commissioner, with Commissioner Chandler, I was part of the decision-making that he talked about, and as a former commissioner, I agree with everything that he said.”
White, “May I reiterate to you, Commissioners, I know that it’s been talked about that the county is broke, or that we are underfunded. This budget is not underfunded. I’ve spent a lot of time putting this all together. The monies are there to fund what was presented to you. The Justice Fund, again, is up against its levy limit. It’s Levy rate, and I have too much paper. So, in comparison to last year’s levy rate, Current Expense, Road and Bridge, Airport are a little bit below their levy rate of what they were a year ago. District Court is a little bit up. Uh, the Fair, the levy rate is just a little bit down. The Justice Fund is actually down from the current levy, or the proposed levy rate, is .001998. Last year, it was 1,3 9,s nines.(.001999)so it’s just down, just a little bit. And then when you go on down, because there was discussion of increasing the dollar amount to the museum, that levy rate is a little bit up.Um, the other one that is up is Solid Waste. Our tort levy is down. Our Rodent Control, which is a separate budget, but it is actually down. So, as far as your levy rate, overall is down from what it was a year ago. And like I said, your last Remaining Cash, Statement of Treasurer’s Cash, and Operations in Funds that you approved on the record was $15 million. The budget is 20, and you’re levying for 6.8.”
Marvin, “So, Donna, in the last 4 years, what percentage have we done raises? Seven, seven, eight, do you know?
White, “So in the 2019-2020 budget, it was 3% to employees, 2% to department heads, 2021 was 3% across the board. 2022, 3%. 23 was a 7 and 23-24 was a 4.And then, um… I have emails from different counties within the state regarding wages. Franklin County, and this is for the budget going forward for 2026 budget. Franklin County is giving a 3% COLA and a 2% merit increase.”
Marvin, “For this year?”
White, “For the 2026 budget starting October 1, and Ada County and don’t get me wrong, I know they’re much bigger and have a much larger tax base, they are doing a 1.5%
COLA 2.5% merit, which is a total of 4%, or an $8 million hit to their budget. Yes, that’s Ada County. Um… Lewis County is… uh, 3% and gave elected officials an extra $1,000, because they had employees that were making more than elected officials. Um, Boundary County is doing a dollar an hour flat, and then $1.50 an hour to law enforcement. Jerome County is up to 8% increase for the Sheriff’s Office, which is a 4% COLA and 4% merit,6% to everyone else, which is 3 and 3. Uh, Gem County is doing a 4% COLA. Idaho County, 4% salary dispersed to department heads as they see fit. ‘Elected officials did get a significant boost after I did a comparison to other counties. We are beginning to panic a bit because several of us are reaching retirement age, and no feasible replacements within the ranks.’ So that’s what’s happening statewide.”
Chandler, “I think the one difference in… Because I know we used to use other counties to compare. But I don’t know if any of those other counties are getting sued like we are right now. You know, two major lawsuits, and… tort claims and other pending stuff coming at us because of decisions that were made and so I… I think that is probably the big difference. If we were… Going along fine, the assets values were going up. We’ve been, you know, in the past, we’ve been able to lower the… The levy rate… That’s good, but we’re not in that position now. Those other counties are not in the position we are right. We could… we could cut a whole bunch of money out of the road repairs, but..”
White, “I went back and added money into that after…” Chandler, “No, I’m just saying..”
White, ‘No, I’m just saying that I met with Jerod, and we increased a bunch of his lines, or some of his lines to cover for work on the roads moving forward, because it would fit.”
Chandler, “Okay, I’m not talking about that. I’m just saying that you could do that and would save some money, but then you would have employees that weren’t working. I’ve seen situations like that when I was a commissioner, where people in another county came in and said, okay, we’re… we’re cutting back all our services, but we’re going to keep all of our employees, because they’re important to us, and they’re just gonna sit in the office until we get more money.
White, “We are not at that point.”
Chandler, “Well, the fact that our, the fact that our major expense in the county is salaries, we can’t just go on, keep funding higher and higher salaries when we don’t have the money to even pay. I mean, we don’t know this coming year what these lawsuits are gonna cost us. It may be in the millions. And we don’t have that in the budget. I’m not sure, you know, what’s been said today that, uh. The emergency funds are gone, the PILT money’s about gone. What are we gonna fall back on if… if we come up with a… huge settlement that the county has to pay?”
White, “The Emergency Funds are calculated into the current budget that is being proposed. We did pay the Idaho Power Judgement.
Chandler, “Okay.”
White, “And we are not going to the taxpayer to levy that back to the county. We still have money in the PILT fund. It’s not entirely gone, but it’s not what it was. I’m not saying that we’re broke, I’m not saying that we don’t have rainy-day funds, we just don’t have as much as we had in the past.”
Harberd acknowledged Bonnie Davis, Weed Superintendent.
Davis, “I don’t want to be a fun killer here. I’m sorry, but this is your guys’ meeting, your guys’ workshop. I don’t think we’re getting anywhere. I feel like more, it’s more like a hearing, and it’s not. Um, number one, I suggest county employees Department Heads, Elected Officials. I think we all ought to do a budget 101. And figure out just exactly what we are doing. So maybe we can get on the same page. I’ve been at this since 2000, and it’s always been done basically the same. There’s problems, you go in, you gotta make cuts, You know, back and forth. But we could debate this all afternoon, and hear comments and things, and at the end of the day, I’m sorry, but it’s going to be up to you three gentlemen what you do. We all want the best for our employees. But you have to do what you have to do. That’s just my two cents but I’m old and cranky, so there. You’re welcome.”
Wilkerson, “Mr. Chairman, I’d like to take off where she started a little bit, and maybe I’m gonna go into the past.We can’t do anything about. One is the hearing, and this…
White, “What hearing?”
Wilkerson, “A hearing. This has been treated more as a hearing than a meeting. And one of my concerns was when I received this budget last week, at 2 o’clock, I was to make a decision on it by 2.30.
White, “ It wasn’t set for a specific time.”
Wilkerson. “Yeah, we had budget discussions starting at 2 o’clock that wasn’t even on the agenda to be discussed.”
White, “It was on the Workshop Agenda and I will own it, it didn’t get posted, but that…
Wilkerson, “But that’s not… that’s not my point. My point is we received this paperwork at 2 o’clock in the afternoon. And was asked to make a decision to put it to print by 2.30. I didn’t have time to look through any of this.”
White, “This is the same paperwork that you received in June in our first budget workshop with the, the only changes were the ones that Commissioner Marvin suggested. And all of that is in your book.”
Wilkerson, “It’s in this book here, and I went back through the book, and there was a lot of empty papers, empty lines, and what I received in June. What I would like to see in the future, just to… just a consideration, is we receive this the Monday before the Monday we put to publication so we have time, like we’ve had, to go through it and ask questions to get some clarity. The other thing I would like to see, is one more hearing before we get similar to what we’ve got right now. So the people can have input before it goes to publication. And if we back up, you say there’s still PILT funding available, right?”
White, “There is still money in the PILT fund, yes.” Wilkerson, “How much is in PILT?”
White, “One paper I didn’t bring down here, Gordon. Well, I’ll pull it just a minute.”
Wilkerson, “There’s some things in the Justice Fund that I like to see modified if possible, and one is outside legal counsel that we’ve had to use in the past. The other one that’s concerning, that I don’t know that we need to fund is the repair and maintenance of the prosecuting attorney’s office that we now own. That maintenance money is gone. If it needs some update or some paint. Maybe we can find money somewhere. There’s one thing that is concerning that has happened in the past that maybe doesn’t need to happen or maybe it won’t happen again, was the communication. The way I understand it, True was not any part of putting his part of the budget to the final numbers. Communication was lacking. I don’t know where the communication… I don’t know where the communication fell, but it did and that’s unfortunate. As far as the t use of the PILT money for paying the Idaho Power Tax, we made a decision to do that so that we didn’t burden the taxpayer for that decision. One thing that I didn’t think about clearly enough, was when we did that, we eliminated Idaho Power, basically, we eliminated Idaho Power’s responsibility for any of that money. And this was brought to my attention in the way that, and I’ll try and explain it. The way that the city of… the School District at Midvale handled their reimbursement. They went straight to the taxpayers and put a one- year levy on it. And by doing that, they involved Idaho Power in paying $41,000 of an
$86,000 debt. I’ve talked to Sabrina about that, and again, this is all in the past. Maybe it was a really poor decision, maybe it was the right decision to make. Had we done what Midvale done. We had an 800 and some thousand dollar debt to pay, the county did. Had we done what Midvale done. Idaho Power would have paid a substantial amount, about a quarter of that.”
White, “And the rest would have went to the County Taxpayer.”
Wilkerson, “Right, but by doing what we did, we’ve depleted our PILT fund until we can’t.”
White, “We have $834,000 left in PILT.”
Wilkerson, “And our prosecuting attorney’s office has taken a $60,000, a $40,000.”
White, “It’s on the revenue side Gordon. Part of that, like I said, the PILT funds that came in, we got $1,073, and we put over a million dollars into this current budget on the revenue side.”
Wilkerson, “And we can’t put any more in it?” White, “I didn’t say that.”
Wilkerson, “Okay.”
White, “ I’m telling you what was done historically. I’m telling you that I projected
$450,000 in revenue from the PILT money because we never know how much we’re gonna get, we never know if it’s fully funded until we get the money. And I did put
$48,000 back into the PILT fund that we used to pay Idaho Power, which was over a million dollars. Because at one point, we had $1.5 million dollars in there. Not today. So I put $48,000 back into the PILT fund. If you want me to move it all, I’ll move it. But I put more money into the revenue side of the budget we’re trying to build than I had projected to put in there when I did the projections for current year.”
Debbie Moxley-Potter, Assessor, “And that was for the Justice Fund? $525 in the Justice Fund?”
White, “Yes.”
Thomas, “You said do away with repairs and maintenance? What are you talking about?”
White, “There was $5,000 in the prosecutor’s office, and then it was decided, my understanding, when we had our last meeting, is that it would be paid out of Justice Fund Building and Grounds. Anything that happened to the Prosecutor’s office, so I took that
$5,000 out of that line. That was what I understood to be said at our first meeting.” Wilkerson, “$25,000 off of last year’s line.”
White, “Excuse me?”
Thomas, “Yeah, well, that’s, I had to cut, that’s part of the cuts that I did that make the budget work.”
Marvin, “What page is that?” Wilkerson, “45. Capital other.”
Thomas, “I thought you were looking at Building and Grounds. Never mind.”
White, “And in that line, based on history and the prosecutor’s budget, in 2023, it was
$5,000, 2024 it was $5,000, 2025, it was $25,000, and of the past 3 years none of that had been expended.
Wilkerson, “We didn’t own a building to maintain.” White, “We did not.”
Wilkerson, “Now we do.”
White, “I was told at our budget workshop to, it was going to be coming out of Building and Grounds in the Justice Fund, which is two pages back.”
Wilkerson, “Okay, so it has been determined, decided to take, use money out of Building and Grounds for the Prosecuting Attorney’s building.?
White, “That was my understanding.” Wilkerson, “Okay.”
White, “In that line, we had, uh, our Building and Grounds Supervisor had asked to increase that due to the increased cost of materials. So he had requested $207,000, and then when we had to do budget cuts, and Matt came to my office, we reduced it down to
180. So, we took $27,000 out of that line to balance the budget. On page 47.”
Wilkerson, “So, in the prosecuting attorney’s budget, then, the capital other, maintenance, hasn’t disappeared, it’s been moved. So that’s all part of his budget anymore, is what you’re saying. In the comments in some of the other lines that are in here, the comments states it’s either moved to here, or gone to there or chose to be eliminated and this comment it just says building maintenance and repair. That’s why we’re having this session, so we get some answers. Perfect. We’re making headway.”
White, “On the paperwork that I got from True, there was no dollar amount there, there was no line through it, it was left blank.”
Wilkerson, “Well, I’m gonna elaborate a little more about the communication. When I was at the ranch and an employee didn’t show up. The employee told, well, I gave you a text message, you didn’t get it? No. Do not text message me with the information you’re not gonna make it to work. You call somebody, make sure it happens. Communication needs to be a little better.
In your budget, True, now that you don’t have to repair, or worry about the repair and maintenance of your office. If there was anything to do that would enhance or make. What do you feel you really have to have to make this budget work for you?”
Pearce, “The biggest issue would just be that line for other, uh, that contract line that’s been removed. We use that, I mean, we… it’s… there’s been a lot used out of it in years past.”
Wilkerson, “Well, the one question that I’ve got is we used to pay $12,000 a year for rent to the prosecuting attorney?”
Pearce, “Correct.”
Wilkerson, “And that’s been taken out, because we don’t have that expense. Is there any way that could be put into the line for outside legal counsel?”
Pearce, “So, uh, Mr. Wilkerson, when we met and discussed this budget, I met with the commissioners in open meeting, and we went over this budget line by line and discussed that that was something that could be taken out and used somewhere else. Um, so I understand that, uh, there was a lack of communication with the clerk’s office, but this, my understanding was that we had discussed this in an open meeting, and that she sat right there uh, where we actually discussed this exact issue. So, I didn’t know that the document that she received was insufficient, so I guess for that, I apologize, but this was done in open meeting, where we went over each of these issues line by line, with you, the commissioners. So, that was something that we discussed could be used somewhere else in, in general. um… At that time, it was… it seemed pretty obvious that we had plenty of money in this budget to be able to fund what we needed to as well as give me the 4% COLA that the rest of the county got.
When we discussed this originally, I had no idea that there was going to be additional things removed other than what we had discussed.”
White, “So, Commissioners, do you want me to move revenue from the PILT fund to increase the justice fund. The wages, and his contract line, the wages for the sheriff’s office, do you want me to do that?”
Marvin, “I think so rather than take it out of the Emergency Reserve Fund.” White, “But we’re talking the entire Justice Fund?”
Marvin, “Excuse me?”
White, “When I met with Matt, and he said to take all the wage increases out of the Justice Fund, are you wanting me to put enough money in the Justice Fund to cover wage increases for All Justice Fund employees as it was left in for the rest of the County?”
Marvin, “I think all we’re talking about right now is the contract.” Harberd, “12,000?”
Marvin, “The $10,000 for contracts, line 689. But you want to take that out of PILT, or take it out of the Emergency Fund?”
Wilkerson, “Both are undiscretionary funds, right?”
White, “The Emergency is a budgeted line, your PILT is undesignated funds. If you want me to move revenue from the PILT Trust to the Justice Fund revenue, I can do that.”
Thomas, “What are you going to do if they don’t fund PILT next year?” White, “Very good question.”
Marvin, “Then we’re going to have a jail and nothing else. We won’t have a sheriff’s office. And we’ve talked about that the last 4 or 5 years. It’s gonna happen sometime. We just don’t… don’t know when. It, it scares me, because I don’t know how we’re going to fund it.”
Wilkerson, “Well, my crystal ball shows a lot of legal problems coming. It’s probably going to take a lot of information. Ten thousand dollars is ten thousand dollars, but if they fund PILT next year, $10,000 is a drop in the bucket.”
Marvin, “Yeah, exactly.”
Wilkerson, “We’re gonna have bigger problems than $ten thousand dollars.”
Marvin, “So I would make a motion that we put the $10,000 back in contracts out of the PILT money in the Justice Fund for Prosecuting Attorney.”
Wilkerson, “I’ll second that.”
Harberd, “There’s been a motion and a second to put the $10,000 back into the Justice Fund out of the PILT money. Those in favor?”
Wilkerson, “Aye.” Harberd, “Aye.” Marvin, “Aye.”
Harberd, “Motion carries.”
Wilkerson, “Mr. Chair. Is the Prosecutor entitled to the 4% COLA that he didn’t receive from last year’s pay increase across the board?”
Marvin, “I don’t know the answer to that.”
Harberd, “I don’t either.”
White, “Pay increases are done at the beginning of the… they’re paid through… at the beginning of the new fiscal year, which is 10-1. And so, wages were calculated at the wage increases that were approved by the Board for the budget that was adopted in August of 2024. In those… at that budget hearing, and what was presented, and I just read to you that,the wage increases were given. The former prosecutor’s wage went from, if you look at your budget paperwork in 2024 he was paid $96,012.80. If you do a 3% on top of that, and then if you add another 3% the 101,244 whatever that number is, is basically almost 6% over what the former prosecutor was making in 2024.”
Pearce, “It was budgeted at $101.244”
White, “Sir, I tried to explain this to you before, we had cushion in lines because sometimes every 11 years, there’s an extra pay period. So, in order to not make a big hit to a budget, or to the taxpayer. I had cushion in those budgeted lines. Delton Walker got the same wage increase October 1 as every other employee in this county. Which brought him up to 99,000 and change for an annual wage. When you came into office, the Commissioners agreed to pay you that full $101,000 that was in the budget. Which was the cushion that was in that budgeted line for the extra pay period.”
Pearce, “Salaries are salaries, they are not hourly, they are exactly what they are. Where did the difference go then? I’ve asked other counties, and they’ve never heard of a cushion in the budget.
White, “For the extra pay period? Maybe they pay monthly instead of every two weeks.”
Pearce, “Well, I’ve asked other counties, and that isn’t a thing, according to them. If it was on the budget, that is what the pay was.”
White, “It is a thing according to the Clerks who are the budget officers for the County.”
Wilkerson, “I’m a little in the dark, because his, Delton’s budget looks much different than the other budgets, in the fact that it was budgeted for 101244, and he took $96,012. No one else’s budget is…
White, “no, you’re backing up, you’re backing up.” Pearce, “That’s what it shows.”
White, “The $96,000.” Wilkerson,” is actual.”
White, “Was for 2024, we’re talking 2025, and Dalton took a 3% increase on the $96,000 which brought him up to $99,000 and change. The budgeted amount for 2025 was $101.
There was a little bit of extra money in that line. When True came in and met with the commissioners, they agreed to pay him the 101. You can’t go back and pick up money from a former budget, because you’re talking taxpayer dollars, you can’t go backwards and collect that money.”
Pearce, “There is nothing on this sheet that shows $99,000.” White, “I know, because it’s in payroll.”
Pearce, “Well, my question is, is why is this incorrect, then?”
White, “I’ve just tried to explain it to you multiple times. I tried to explain it to you the day you took office.”
Pearce, “So, let me ask it this way, then. How many of the other numbers in this budget are not accurate?”
Wilkerson, “Look, the question is, if we go to the Assessors Budget, salaried budget, and actual that matches.”
Harberd, “What page is that?”
Wilkerson, “Page 2, page 3. The budgeted amount for 2024 was $77.900, the actual was
$77,900. You go through all of the elected officials’ salaries and they all match. What come in, what went out.
White, “If you notice, the prosecutor’s budget was that same dollar amount for 2 years.” Wilkerson, “Correct.”
White, “Even though it wasn’t all expended, so…” Wilkerson, “But he didn’t actually take the 101,244.” White, “The former prosecutor did not, no.”
Wilkerson, “Then there should be a, like $10,400 a carryover on that line.” White, “No.”
Thomas, “Carryover is each year. It doesn’t work that way. You can’t go back 5 years and count that as carryover. Carryover is each year.”
White, “And if you remember when the outside auditor comes in and presents to you, he says at the end of the year, you want 4 to 6 months carryover in order to get through to your next big… big, uh, tax remittance that is received. And every year, our auditor has
provided a good report that we have always been within that 4 to 6 months carryover in order to fund our budgets. That happens annually when the CPA comes and gives his report.”
Marvin, “What do you want to do?”
Wilkerson, “Do you understand the salary on the prosecuting attorney?
Marvin, “I do. But True didn’t get the raise last year. I think he… should be able to get what he’s requested this year. Which is…”
Wilkerson, “3%, right?
Marvin, “$104,282 is what he has requested.” Harberd, “And that’s the 3%, right? The $104?”
Marvin, “Do the math, it’s $3,030. But then you gotta figure there’s a little bit in there for benefits, for PERSI and whatever. Social Security. So… So I guess she just used the number that he’s put in there, the 104282. That kind of catches him up, not completely… completely if we give 3% this year, but… I haven’t made my mind up yet whether I’m willing to do the 3% this year. We’ve done… we’ve done some pretty good raises; 3%, 3%, 3%. Did you say 7% 2023?”
White, “A couple years ago, yeah.”
Harberd, “That was for all the County employees? The 7%?”
Marvin, “I believe so. Probably get shot when I walk out of the courthouse.” White, “So you’re..
Harberd, “You won’t be alone.”
White, “You’re also giving up levy authority, which is going to take you a long time to make up.”
Marvin. “Yeah, I couldn’t hear ya.”
White, “I said if you want me to go back and reduce everything back down, you’re giving up levy authority, which means you’re levying… you’re leaving money on the table, and you will not be able to make that up in one year.”
Harberd, “Damned if you do and damned if you don’t. What do you want to do, boys?”
Wilkerson, “Well, to be clear, what are we thinking about? There’s about three things on the table.”
Pearce, “You guys also need to address your museum and social… or your senior citizens from the last meeting, the changes that you made there. Because we declared everything you did null and void today, so…”
Marvin, “Thank you.”
Pearce, “You need to address that as well.”
Marvin, “Um…I think we should… give True what he’s asked for in his salary, but I don’t know where you want to take it from. And I don’t know what to do, but… the employees, 3%. We’ve been pretty good, and I know last year I was on my soap box thing, the employees are our most valuable asset, and we need to take care of them, and, but we got a lot of things looking us in the face this year that we didn’t have last year. Um…So I guess the first thing I’m gonna do is I’m gonna fix the cure from last week for the museum. What line is that? I’m trying to find it here.
White, “It’s in Fund 12, Museum. Senior Center is in the Current Expense Fund.” Marvin, “What page?”
White, “Page 53.”
Marvin, “Okay. So, so what I’m gonna propose is we, we had $6,000 to split between the museum and the senior centers. So, I’d make a motion that we give $3,000 to the Historical Society and Museum, and we give 3,000 to the senior centers.”
Wilkerson, “Second.”
Harberd, “There’s been a motion and a second to give the Historical Society $3,000, and then $3,000 split between the senior citizen centers. Those approve?”
Wilkerson, “Aye.” Harberd, “Aye.” Marvin, “Aye.”
Collini, “That was not the motion that was made. What the chairman said was not the same motion that you made, Commissioner Marvin”
Harberd, “Do your motion again.”
Marvin, “Okay. so my motion was to take the $6,000 that originally was going to go to the museum. And take 3,000 of that, give it to the museum, $3,000 to give it to the senior centers to split between the two.
Harberd, “To split between the Senior Centers. Marvin, “To split it evenly.”
Collini, “You said that(inaudible) museum and then split between the two senior centers, and that’s not what the original motion was.”
Harberd, “It’s 3,000 to the museum, and 3,000 to the Senior Centers.” Collini, “Yes. You said to both Senior Centers.”
Marvin, “So that would be $1,500 to Weiser Senior Center and $1,500 to Cambridge Senior Center.”
Collini, “Okay, that wasn’t in the motion. In your motion.”
Marvin, “That was my intent That’s, uh, there’s 3,000 to divide up between the two senior centers, so…”
Collini, “Okay.”
Wilkerson, “Second.”
Marvin, “Want me to start over?” Pearce, “You should.”
Marvin, Okay, Okay, so my… I’ll make a motion that we take the $6,000 and give 3,000. Harberd, “From the Historical Society.
Marvin, “From the… yeah,”
Harberd, “They were gonna get 6 more.”
Marvin, “Yeah, they asked for 6,000 additional funds, and we agreed that we would give them $3,000 of the 6,000 and the three other, the balance, 3,000 would go to Weiser Senior Center and Midvale Cambridge Senior Center, divided equally.”
Wilkerson, “Second.”
Marvin, “That’s a little cleaner.”
Harberd, “There’s been a motion and a second to approve taking the 6,000 that the Historical Preservation Committee was going to get, giving the preservation $3,000. The balance of $3,000 from that $6,000 will go to the senior citizen centers of Weiser and Midvale. Cambridge and Midvale are together, aren’t they?”
“Yes. It’s one”
Harberd, “All those in favor?” Wilkerson, “Aye.”
Harberd, “Aye.”
Marvin, “Aye.”
Harberd, “Motion carries.”
Marvin, “I would make a motion that we change the prosecutor’s salary to what he’s requested for 2026 budget year, which is $104,282 and take that out of the PILT fund.”
Wilkerson, “Second.”
Harberd, “There’s been a motion and a second to approve the Prosecuting Attorney’s salary of $104,282. Giving him that and taking the money from the PILT fund. All those in favor?
Wilkerson, “Aye.” Harberd, “Aye.” Marvin, “Aye.”
Harberd, “Opposed? Motion carries.”
Marvin, “What do you guys want to do on the salaries? If we don’t take ‘em it’s going to mess up our levies and we’re gonna, like Donna said, leave money on the table that could be used for other things. I don’t know the dollar amount. Donna, do you know how much that was?”
White, “Just in wages?” Wilkerson, “Roughly.” Marvin, “Just a ballpark.”
White, “Oh, yeah, there’s only 100 some employees that fall into this, so I don’t know.”
Davis, “I don’t know where you’re gonna find the money to give Matt’s guys raises. I’m just saying.”
Thomas, “This is amazing.”
Davis, “Because it affects everything, because the wages affect all the benefits. So, this is going to take a while to decipher this. And different budgets, some of them, like mine, the Weed Department, our benefits and everything come out of our budget, but a lot of them come out of one. I don’t know how you come up with an accurate answer.”
Wilkerson, “It’s one of those things where it may be a little too late to change that much at this time.”
White, “The current budget, just for the..
Marvin, “And the problem is that you can’t take money out of these other funds and put it into the Justice Fund where it needs to be.”
White, “No. So, when you do those cuts you are giving up levy authority for every other fund. So the current… for the Justice Fund, the salaries are $2,973,184.00. Benefits are
$1,179,260.00 and the other expenses is $1.5 million. So, and then for Current Expense, the current wages are $1,597,883.00, benefits are $800, excuse me, $644,950.00.”
Marvin, “That was which fund?”
White, “That was Current Expense. The first one I read was Justice Fund. Then if you want to look at Road and Bridge, current salaries are $952, benefits are $428,700 and the total budget is $3,790,000.00.”
Wilkerson, “By making an adjustment that large, we create, Marvin, “It’s gonna be a ripple effect.
White, “You’re going to create a bigger problem moving forward.”
Wilkerson, “It’s not going to be throwing a rock in a pond it’s going to be throwing.. Marvin, “boulder.”
Wilkerson, boulders in a mud puddle.
Marvin, “Probably should be addressed in next year’s budget.’
Wilkerson, “Well keep in mind, next year things are going to be different. We’re gonna be, at this point, we’re gonna be walking over dollars to pick up dimes. We’ve told the
people that, the employees have seen it, they can smell it, they just haven’t touched it yet. I don’t, as much as I would like to save the money, I think you’re gonna be spending money.
Marvin, “Yeah.”
Wilkerson, “that’s the unfortunate part of the structure of government.” Marvin, So. Do we need to read that notice for publication again?”
White, “I need a motion to publish it with the changes that you’ve made today.” Wilkerson, “Did we hit all the changes that we made last week?”
White, “The only changes you made last week. I mean, I discussed the ones that you went over that we reviewed for Road and Bridge. You made the changes for the Senior Center and the museum.”
Wilkerson, “There is one thing that I would like to address before we go further. And I don’t know what can be, I don’t know, if there’s any changes that can be made, or should be made, but Jerod has been working on a STEP program for payment for a while now and that was brought up last week and it was shot down before he had a chance to even talk about what his work had come up with. I would really like to hear what he has to say about it.”
Odoms, “Again, I did not bring the tomatoes. Thank you, Commissioners. Interesting day we have.”
Wilkerson, “And the folks behind you have no idea.”
Odoms, “So, what I presented, so the public is aware, um, over the last… I was hired at the end of 2019, and I was asked at the time, um, the…”
Wilkerson, “By Commissioners Marvin.”
Odoms, “That is correct, by Commissioner Marvin, and we are fortunate to have the other commissioners that were sitting on the panel at that time in the room. To design a step and grade scale for road and bridge and solid waste. So, I went and I actually did a bunch of that work. Um, brought in several copies, uh, we refined it, we went back, there was a few years that, that we just could not make it work with the funding that we had available. Um, and then 2 years ago, we were able to implement the grade portion of that into Road and Bridge, not the step portion. Uh, last year, we, um…
Thank you. Last year, we, um, um, didn’t quite have enough to make it all work. Uh, but this year, with the preliminary numbers that I had, I could make it work for Road and Bridge and I could make a portion of it work for solid waste to bring those up to where they should be. Um, I did put those in the packet that was presented, um, along with um,
several, we discussed several concerns last week of this. Um, the interesting thing, and I know Donna and I sat down, um, the Thursday prior to last week’s meeting. And, um, there had been some changes in that top budget there, in the A budget, and in the D, of course, because the wages determine the benefits. So, my proposed budget with the step and grade for Road and Bridge was $3,929,510. Um, after the adjustments that came in last week, my budget was, um, proposed at $4,007,742. And that was with the removal of the additional of the steps, and just a 3% increase.
Um, with some minor modifications to the Budget Officers proposed, I could make the step and grade work with what we have. The issue of it is… there are several issues, Commissioners, that need to be looked at here. In the onset of a step and grade system, it’s a big jump all at once, but then over the years, It’s smaller increases.
One of the issues that came up over the last few years at our budget hearings was the public had made mention that they would like to see a cap on wages, and they didn’t want us paid to just sit here and be an employee. So the step and grade, actually, you are rewarded for education in your line of work, and for your years of service. So, every 5 years, you would get that increase of a dollar every 5 years. That’s not a huge percentage over 5 years. So, if you were just a warm body every 5 years, you’d get a dollar. If you lasted that long in my department. Um, Solid Waste is different. Solid waste does not have as big a budget as Road and Bridge. Um, so we would only be able to implement the grade portion and the years of service portion, not the education portion yet. And that was actually in the budget the last time I looked. Now, um… Commissioner Marvin, you did request this, um, and it was the proposal. And I understand that, you know, I don’t always get what I want. Don’t ask my wife, because she says otherwise, but, I know that if the law states we can’t get an increase because nobody else gets an increase, then we need to follow the law. Unfortunately, that’s the truth of it. But, I do not envy you gentlemen today, because if we do not take the 3%, at least the 3%, and we leave that levy authority on the table. That’s, I think, in the long run, a bigger issue. We are only getting bigger, we’re only getting busier. Every department is seeing more taxpayers come into their offices. That phone rings more, there’s more demand for service. My guys are out there right now putting down 24 miles worth of chip seal in the next 2 weeks. The largest
we’ve done that I know of in the last 30 years.” Wilkerson, “Probably in history.”
Odoms, “It’s a good possibility.”
Wilkerson, “They do that kind of work 30 years ago.”
Odoms, “I can only speak for my two departments and know that we are seeing increases in every service that we provide. Things are not getting cheaper. Things are only costing more. And if it’s the will of the people that we do this, and we have a cut, and we do that, then we need to know what services, then, we have to cut back. That’s the unfortunate thing. I am a very conservative person. When it comes to government, there’s certain aspects that have to function, and there are certain numbers and ways that have to be done, unfortunately, to make things work out how they need to work out for tomorrow. I
think one of the problems in my two departments is we’ve never looked far enough into the future, and we pay for it today. This was a proposal that I would like, if it’s not funded this year, which this is up to the commissioners, you are… in charge of wages and my two departments. I would like it to at least be considered in the future.
Wilkerson, “If this was implemented this year, how would it change the structure of what’s proposed to go to paper right now? Donna would start throwing boulders, I’m sure.”
Odoms, “Um… So, the… right now, so if I ran these numbers correctly, and I did them three times, and all three times, I did have my eyes open. Um… My original proposed budget, like I said, was the 3.9, then with the adjustment, we came the $4 million. If I was to adjust some of the numbers that her and I adjusted in her office that day of the B budget, and then put back the original numbers for Road and Bridge, um, I would actually leave $232 on the table.”
Wilkerson, “Wouldn’t change your budget much at all.” Odoms, “No.”
Wilkerson, “And in the long run, it’s gonna save the taxpayers, because…”
Odoms. “That is the proposal, and I know that there was some discussion. I know it’s been looked at in the past. Um, and I know there was discussion that it didn’t work for other departments.
I’m not other departments.”
Wilkerson, “That’s why I wanted to hear yours.”
Odoms, “The, um, overtime is managed. I can’t imagine that you send a deputy home after 12 hours worth of work, and not do his, or hers, uh, 13th and 14th hour for paperwork, or whatever they have to do, or not respond to that 911 call. Um, the only time we get a lot of overtime, and that’s only if I plan it out. Chip seal, and snow removal.”
Wilkerson, “January and February.”
Odoms, “Correct. Every other time, it’s up to me whether I let them get that time or not. I think, and I could be wrong, I’ve been wrong twice this year, that if I manage it like it should be managed, I don’t see a lot of overages and overspending in that line.”
Wilkerson, “My concern is, hearing this now is a little too… a little too late, because you’re gonna put a great strain on the clerk’s office trying to… make anything work in time to go to press.
What do you guys feel?”
Harberd, “I agree with you as far as that goes. I think it’s something…”
Marvin, “I’ve encouraged Jerod every year, to try to put this together, and we’ve never had the money to quite get it over the edge. Um, there seems like there’s always something, equipment, asphalt.
Wilkerson, “This is another reason we need to have a meeting like this a long time ago.” Harberd acknowledged Juvenile Probation Supervisor, Dahlia Stender.
Stender, “I’ve been here for almost 27 years. I’ve never seen anything like this, ever. Um, I don’t know how you guys would justify giving him a 12.5% increase when our Justice Department, our Justice Fund employees are not getting any. And you guys are talking about not giving the rest of us any, which is fine, if that’s what you decide. I just don’t know how you can justify giving him and his department that much. And I realize there’s some pet departments here, which is really, really obvious. I think we all should be valued the same. I don’t know any one department that does more than the other ones, in our fields.”
Odoms, “She’s absolutely right. We are not the same. We don’t do the exact same job, and we are all valued and should be revalued accordingly. I agree with her 100% on that. Um, the other side of that is, is that the monies that I operate off of are separate funds. They don’t go into the Justice Fund. They don’t go into the General Fund. They come in for specific departments.
Stender, “Mine do too, most of mine.”
Odoms, “That’s good. And so, I was fulfilling the request of the people and the commissioners of the time. And it’s a proposal. I don’t get to sign off on it and say, yes, this is how it’s going to be. It’s a proposal for consideration. And, uh, Commissioner Marvin, um, it does also increase. Um… the mag chloride, asphalt, um, let’s see, the repairs, expense, buildings, and maintenance, um. So, several of those up through there we do get, and that still leaves the $350,000 for the two new pieces of equipment. The
$411,000 for the six leased pieces of equipment, and $450,000 for another 24 miles of chip seal next year, amongst various other aspects. Like I said, not an easy position for you gentlemen to be in.”
Wilkerson, “The 12.5% increase in salaries, where does the money come out of your budget to do this?”
Odoms, “This is actually..”
Marvin, “Are these grade… grade increases, step grades?”
Odoms, “The grades are already in place. These are just the steps to go on top of it.” Marvin, “Okay.”
Odoms, “Um, we have an increase from the State that has been projected, and we also had to increase, otherwise, uh, from our, our levy, because otherwise we would have lost that authority.”
Davis, “And then in addition, you had to cut the roadside spray budget for next year.”
Odoms, “That was in the, in the original um, weed control, yes, and then that was actually in the proposed from… Um, the budget officer as well.”
White, “And then to make it fit, we’ve cut it back down.” Davis, “Cut it back out.”
Odoms, “Yeah.”
White, “I tried to bump it back up to the 75 that is currently budgeted, but I had to take it back down to 50 to make it fit.”
Odoms, “So that one stayed across the board in all of those. I know in the past, there has been several comments about FAIR. I don’t believe life is fair. I also don’t believe that, um… everybody should be paid exactly the same, because all of our jobs are different. We should be paid according to our line of work, and I know that, I sympathize with the Justice Fund. I really do. Because when I call 911, I like a deputy to show up. And I proposed at the meeting, what can we do to help? What can we do to… to, uh, figure out a solution. I brought up potential impact fees. Maybe we put those in place now, so in 5 years they’re actually paying for something. I mean, as it is now, I’m… my brain is already on snow and working on spring in my head. Um, where are we at in 5 years?
Where are we at in 20 years?”
Harberd, “I don’t feel, at the time, the way things are right now, that we should probably not do the step increases. Possibly something to look at next year. With all the uncertainty going on. Just my opinion. Nothing against anybody.”
Odoms, “Nope, and it makes sense.”
Wilkerson, “I’m glad that you brought this forward. It’s something that I hadn’t seen. Nate had discussed having you do this or look into this, but I’m with Jim. I don’t think it’s time to completely blow the budget that’s on paper now, ready to go to print.
Knowing more about how the budget is structured, and I still don’t know anything I was leaning towards a pay freeze clear across the county, because of what’s in front of us, but I’m afraid if we do that, we’re going to be walking over dollars to pick up dimes, because of how Government is structured. Am I correct, Nate?”
Marvin, “I would agree with both of you. I want to see Jerod get this implemented, but I don’t know if this is the year to do it.”
Wilkerson, “I like the idea. I do like the idea. If your employees…You’ve obviously talked to your employees about this?”
Odoms, “Yeah, yeah, I… they… they know the structure on how that would work, yes. Uh, and it does give them drive to do extra. To become a better employee for the county, yes.”
Wilkerson, “It gives them a big pay… a big bump in pay right off that flatlines for 5 years, outside of grade improvement.”
Odoms, “Mm-hmm.”
Wilkerson, “Which is an incentive to make yourself better. Go to school, learn how to run the grader better.
Harberd, “Where are we then on the raises?” Odoms, “Anything else, Commissioners, for me?” The Board thanked Odoms for his comments.
Assessor, Debbie Moxley-Potter, “I think that it’s clear that we have a missing member of our team. I think we need to see what we can do.”
Harberd, “Sabrina?” Moxley-Potter, “No.” Davis, “No”
Moxley-Potter, “Matt.”
Davis, “Matt.”
Moxley-Potter, “Ya know, he hasn’t taken a raise for many years. I mean, he’s a very important part of our team.”
Unknown speakers, “Sure is.” Harberd, “Yes, he is.
Davis, “And you have that right, Debbie. Team, and we need to all remember that. We’re all in this together.”
Harberd, “Mm-hmm.”
Moxley-Potter, “And I don’t think we can … I mean, to me, it’s not fair to let him walk out of here. I mean, I don’t know, I see you adding money from PILT, I don’t know, does that put us up against our levy if we add money into the Justice Fund?”
White, “I have to transfer money out of our reserve funds into the revenue side to build the budget to give the raise increase that they’ve told me to do.”
Moxley-Potter, “And I don’t think people realize how complex it really is, and nobody in our county is trying to hide anything.”
Davis, “Right.”
Moxley-Potter, “Nobody that I know, after being in this county, working 20 years. I don’t know one dishonest person. I don’t know anybody who would even think of trying to hide something. I just, the comments that are coming are not accurate.”
Marvin, “I say we leave the wages like they are for this year, and try to, try to, if we’re not gonna do anything, and we tell everybody right up front when the budget worksheets are passed out that we are or we aren’t.”
Harberd, “I think that..”
White, “You never, you never know. You don’t know when the budget process starts for my office and for when I give it to the department heads, I’m required by Statute to give it out to everybody in May. At that time, you don’t… we don’t know where we’re gonna
fall, because then what’s taken into consideration is where you are in the middle of July, financially, as far as what has been expended, what’s still on the table, and your best estimate of what you’re going to receive. So you can’t, in my opinion, you can’t hand out the budget paperwork the first part of May and say, we’re not giving raises this year, because you… I don’t know how you would project that. I don’t know how you would feel comfortable saying that.”
Wilkerson, “Almost easier to say you’re not getting raises, and then surprise them with a gift.”
Davis, “I think it’s human nature as a department head elected official, or whatever it is, to want the best for your employees. And I would question anyone who didn’t do that, because, as you said, Nate, and we’ve all said it many, many times. Without our employees, we’re nothing, and this county’s nothing. You know, they’re the ones that… that really care, and we’re the ones that are here for the people. It’s the people that make us do this, certainly not the money. I mean, and I think we all need to go back to that, but we also have to remember we all are a team. And I don’t think you should get too wrapped up on if, if we ask for a 3% or a 10% or Jerod wants step and grade for all his departments, you know? It’s whatever you guys are comfortable with, and whatever is reasonable
for the dollars that we can levy, or that come in from fees, or whatever, for each budget to work. But we gotta remember, we’re in this together, you guys. And I gotta agree with Dahlia on a couple things. I’ve never seen anything quite like this. And I’m not even gonna say how many years I’ve been sitting through these. And it scares me. You gotta remember; Together, we’re strong. And we gotta remember who we work for. And there are really good people in this county. And they’re counting on us. And we gotta get our sheriff.”
Moxley-Potter, “Yeah. We do.”.
Davis, “As soon as you guys release us, I’ll go see if he wants to have a cigarette, okay? Yes, I did say that on the record.”
Harberd acknowledged Kirk Chandler.
Chandler, “I just have a question. Uh, we go through this whole budget process.
As officials in the county. And then we have a budget hearing so the public can tell us what they think. What is the purpose of that hearing?”
Wilkerson, “That was my concern earlier. We get the hearing, we do the hearing process after the budget’s basically final.”
White, “Statutory requirement.”
Chandler, “And so, two years ago, but the public was all in here, and… And gave us… gave you what they thought. And the minute the hearing was over, Lyndon read the resolution, passed the budget, and there was no discussion on what the, the people said. Well, after that, I talked to Sabrina, and she said, well, if you want to input into the budget, you need to come to the budget workshops. We did that last year, and we weren’t allowed to speak. So, and the same thing happened. The budget hearing went forward, and the minute it was over, it was passed. You did discuss a little bit. But it was passed as a… with the idea that, well, it’s already set. And so, I always understood that the hearing was so that, if there was issues at the public, the citizens, the ones that you work for, it could be adjusted after that.”
Harberd, “Is that how you did it when you were commissioner?”
Chandler, “And hearings that we had, we adjusted things after the hearing. And so, I don’t understand, I mean, if the hearing, if the building, if the budget is set, why do we have a hearing? Is it just because state code says you have to? I mean, what’s the purpose?
We won’t be heard at the hearing. And kind of the way it is today, we haven’t been heard today.
Harberd, “Sure talked an awful lot.”
Chandler, “I know, but I agree that this has been a budget workshop, and the public really shouldn’t have input, but when are we gonna have to be heard?”
Harberd, “Well, you’re here right now. And you have your input, you’re putting your input in it. Yes, Mike.”
Mike Keach, “Don’t condescend me, please.” Harberd, “I called you Mike.”
Keach, “I know, but the way you said it, I’m sorry. But we don’t get a chance to come and give our say. We come in here today, and we aren’t… it’s up to you, who you call on. You don’t have to call on any of us today, and we thank you for calling on us.
Harberd, “This isn’t a hearing.”
Keach, “But usually, the last couple years, we’ve had no say in the budget whatsoever.” Harberd; “I can’t help you with that. I wasn’t here.”
Keach, “I’m talking to the group, Jim.” Harberd, “Okay, no, I’m just stating that.” Wilkerson, “We’re running long.”
Harberd, “It’s all… it’s all new to me, the whole thing. It’s very overwhelming.”
Bennatts, “It was new to True. And the thing that was kind of startling to me is this is his orientation for the budget. His orientation for the communication to the clerk. And how to communicate his budget was here today. So he should have had all this stuff coming in as an official, as an employee of the county, he should have been made aware of these difficulties he would be dealing with. Uh, so when he came in, he’d be prepared, and he would see numbers and not changes in those numbers. So, any other department head would just about to come over the table to you guys if you did what you did to him. This is his introduction to the county.”
Harberd, “I’m not disclaiming anything about True at all, but I will say this. A lot of us, if we have questions, we go and ask. I do. I’m saying that in general.”
Bennatts, “Do you have an orientation program for employees in the county?”
Harberd, “Mine’s been pretty, uh… this is my first year. Pretty rough. Yeah, and I’m learning… it’s a pretty rough orientation right here.”
Bennatts, “So, yeah, how about you? Do you feel as though your orientation that you received was on par with what True has experienced?”
Harberd, “I went and asked… I’ve talked to the different department heads, I went and asked… asked them if I had a question. I did.”
Bennatts, “So you don’t think the county is obligated to, when you bring in somebody new to orientate them to the budget and how it works, and to the communication with the clerk, and how that works.”
Chandler, “So, the orientation is at the State meetings. The county officials go to state meetings, and they teach them how to do budgets, and teach them how to run the county, so that’s where that happens. Not here. It happens at the State meetings.”
Wilkerson. “Mr. Chair, let’s get back on the, in the meeting. Where we at?”
Marvin, “I guess, if you’re ready to make a motion to publish the budget, or are you going to discuss it more?”
Wilkerson, “I think our discussion is over. Myself. I think we have, I feel, as bad as it was, we’ve gotten a lot of information and cleaned up some stuff. Especially in the prosecuting attorney’s budget. For me, finding out that the money, a good portion of that money has been moved to a different area. It’s not taken away, but shifted. I would make a motion to approve the budget as amended, and send it to publication.”
Marvin, “I’ll second that.
Harberd, “There’s been a motion and a second, to approve the budget as amended and send it to publication. Those in favor?”
Wilkerson, “Aye.” Marvin, “Discussion?” Harberd, “Sure.”
Marvin, “Several good comments have come up today about maybe having a… workshop that the public can come out and comment on stuff before we get to this here.”
Unknown speaker, “We get here. Yeah. Correct.”
Marvin, “So I’d like to, I don’t know how to do that but I’m sure Donna and Brenda can help us with that next year, that maybe middle of July or something, we can have that, have that workshop. As I’m sure she’ll just be sitting there twiddling her thumbs middle of July with nothing to do, so…”
White, “Every day. I just hang out in my office.”
Marvin, “So I just, I think that’s something that’s good that’s come out of this meeting today. More input from the public, if we can make that happen.”
Wilkerson, “Before we get too deep into it, and it’s not changeable.” Marvin, “Yes.”
Stender, “Can I say something before you guys vote?” Wilkerson, “Okay?”
Harberd, “Mm-hmm.”
Stender, “So, at some point during this meeting you said that it was illegal for some of the employees to get a 3% and some not to. Everybody has to have the same across the board?”
Pearce, “COLA’s.”
Stender, “COLA’s. okay.”
Pearce, “If their cost of living increased, and that’s what we’re calling them, then they can’t, you can’t exclude some people.”
Stender, “So, our Justice Fund employees still do not have any COLA. Pearce, “Is it a COLA or just a?”
Stender, “I thought it was a COLA.”
Marvin, “I just put in what he asked for in his budget. I don’t know if it’s a COLA, or just a budget adjustment.”
Stender, “If everybody else is getting a COLA, those employees still are not accounted for.”
Marvin, “I don’t know who, which budget you’re talking about.” Stender, “The Sheriff’s fund.”
Marvin, “Yeah. Then everybody will get the 3%.” Brenda Lee, “Where is that money coming from?”
Wilkerson, “Sheriff’s Department doesn’t get a 3% this year.” Stender, “That creates a different problem.”
White, “Your motion was to give True his wage increase. It did not mention the deputy prosecutor, nor did you mention the sheriff’s office employees getting a raising this year.”
Stender, “And I’m just going on what you said, that it was illegal for everybody, for just some to get it.”
Marvin, “Well, I think of all the other employees are gonna get that, then the sheriff’s office should get it, too. I don’t know where you’re gonna get the money from but probably have to come out of PILT.”
Wilkerson, “Now you’re digging deep in the PILT.” Marvin, “Yeah.”
Wilkerson, “To fund the whole sheriff’s department.”
Marvin, “But it doesn’t, from what True’s telling us, it’s not..”
Pearce, “It matters how you refer to it. If you refer to it as a COLA, which I believe is what you gave the entire county last year, was it, what, 3.99% or something? As a cost- of-living increase, every department across the county got it, is that correct? Then you can’t exclude some people. If you’re giving raises, if you’re doing it other ways, if it’s for other reasons, then it’s not a COLA is what my understanding is.”
Marvin, “Okay.”
Pearce, “So it depends on how you refer to it. The other thing I will point out is you can reduce things after you publish this, you just can’t increase them.”
Marvin, “Right.”
White, “Correct. We know that.”
Wilkerson, “Nowhere in this budget is it identified as a COLA. It’s a 3% wage increase. Is that being technical or not?”
Pearce, “I mean, I think that’s what it is. You’re not, not excluding one person, you’re, certain departments have money and certain don’t.”
White, “Commissioners, do you want me to move money from PILT to fund the entire Justice Fund with the 3%? I can’t give you a total dollar amount on that. That would take a hot minute to calculate out.”
Marvin, “I didn’t hear what she said.”
Harberd, “She’s gonna try to calculate it out, what it would be.”
White, “I asked if you would like me to back and what would happen is I’d have to pull it from the PILT fund and put it in the revenue side to do the wage increases for Sheriff’s Uh… Sheriff’s Budget 8-2 alone, that’s about $50,000. Approximately.”
Davis, “Is that just the wage part or is that…?”
White, “That’s just wages. That’s not benefits. For the jail.
So at 8… from 845 to 870,000 for a 3% wage increase, then I would have to and I didn’t do the total for benefits. Benefits would be…
The biggest hit was medical insurance, which… wouldn’t change on the benefits side, because medical is per employee. If you want to amend your motion to include a wage increase for the Sheriff’s Office..”
Thomas, “Can I say something?” White, “Thank you, Matt.”
Thomas, “I’m more worried about next year, not 26th, but 27th. All my people know they’re not getting a raise. I don’t want the county or the sheriff’s office to get in a position where I have to lay people off. So, my guys know, guys and gals, know they’re not getting a raise. Let’s just leave it at that because I’m more concerned with the future than I am with next year.”
Wilkerson, “I hear what you’re saying. I’m asking our prosecutor a legal question. Is it a technicality, we don’t call it a COLA, it’s a 3%? Just a wage increase?”
Pearce, “You can give wage increases.” Wilkerson, “Independent of each other?”
Pearce, “I mean, if people deserve it, we can give wage increases.”
Harberd, “But he’s talking, you’re referring to the 3% as just a blanket wage increase.” Wilkerson, “Wage increase.”
Pearce, “Most of the, most of, Mr. Harberd, most of the, um, different, uh… employees across the county are scheduled in this, uh, budget for a 3% increase. The only ones that aren’t are the Justice Fund employees.”
Thomas, “I just don’t know where you guys are gonna get the money. Well, I know where you can get it this year, but what are we gonna do next year when we have to do the budget?”
Marvin, “Don’t know the answer. Especially if PILT goes away.” Thomas, “I know.”
Marvin, “County services. May take a big hit.” Unknown speaker, “Everything will.”
Thomas, “Or even if there’s another housing crisis, or Housing costs dip way down again.
Wilkerson, “My concern is staying in the, in the legal lane so we don’t have an issue. Legally doing what we’re doing. I understand what you’re wanting to do.”
Thomas, “It’s not what I want to do, it’s what I think we have to do.”
Wilkerson, “Well, I understand what you have to do. And I’m not… and I’m not opposed to that. What we need to identify it correctly so we don’t get in a problem, correct?”
Marvin, “Sounds to me like we need to. I just, I guess, Matt, my concern is that you worked so hard to get your pay and step grade put into place.”
Thomas, “Yeah, I haven’t used a step, that step and grade increase for what, two, three years now? Because you, I can’t afford it. Like I told you in the last meeting, it looks great on paper, but once you start implementing it, it doesn’t pin, pin out in the end. It costs a lot more money than you figured, and it just doesn’t work.”
Marvin, “Okay.”
Wilkerson, “Motions have been made to put the thing to press. As amended.” White, “You made a second, you just didn’t vote.”
Marvin, “And that’s what the way it was presented.” Wilkerson, “Call it wage increase.”
Marvin, “Okay.”
Harberd, “And just not for the justice?” Wilkerson, “Justice Fund stays flat.”
Harberd, “Stays flat?”
Marvin, “Like Matt has presented.”
White, “And I’m still to move money from the PILT fund to cover a wage increase for True?
Wilkerson, “Give him what he was entitled to from before.” Marvin, “Okay, Call for the question.”
Harberd, “Those in favor?” Wilkerson, “Aye.”
Harberd, “Aye.”
Marvin, “Aye.”
Harberd, “Motion carries.”
Marvin, “We did our agenda finished for tomorrow, next Monday?” Harberd, “I thought we did.”
Wilkerson, “I think we did.”
Motion by Jim Harberd, seconded by Gordon Wilkerson and unanimously carried to recess at 3:25 p.m. until August 11, 2025 at 8:45 a.m.
Chairman, Board of County Commissioners
ATTEST:
Clerk
A full audio recording of the Commissioner Meeting is available at the Clerk’s Office upon request.